You Down with PvP?
Kognus — Thu, 10/23/2014 - 14:26

Naughy by Nature wants to know if you down with PvP?
<Downfall> has a long history as a fantastic community and a very good end game raiding guild. We are, as far as I know, the only Alliance-side guild on the server to have been an active participant in raiding during Vanilla and every expansion since. We killed Chromaggus on our first ever attempt and then came back the next night and killed Nefarian on our first ever pull too. We cleared AQ40 through Twin Emps pre-nerf while making a brief foray into Naxx 40. We killed Muru in the Sunwell. We killed heroic Lich King in two different independent raids. We did some stuff during Cata which I don’t remember since I was off doing other stuff. We have cut a mighty swath through Pandaland as the best raiding guild on our server cluster during this most recent expansion. This is a damn good PvE guild. However, my purpose for writing this was not to (justifiably) jerk off you dragon killing bad asses. No, I wrote this because I know something. I know that we are capable of being a great PvP guild too.
Now, our guild has had some success in PvP over the years. We’ve had multiple gladiators and many duelists throughout the history of WoW arenas and even had a very competitive RBG team during the first half of Cataclysm. However, I believe that we are capable of more. I firmly believe that good raiders have exactly the right sort of attitude to succeed in rated BGs and arenas too. Becoming a good PvPer requires several things of you…
1) The ability to acknowledge that until you play perfectly all the time in every facet of the game (ability use, communication, positioning, general offensive and defensive tactics, etc.) you still have things to learn. You don’t know everything. Nobody does. I recently watched a video where Rank 1 Gladiator mage Venruki was being interviewed and providing his thoughts on PvP stat priority, gemming, enchanting and reforging (lol!) for frost mages in 5.4. This is a guy
who is more knowledgeable, skilled and experienced at his part of the game than anybody in this guild is likely to ever be at any part of the game. He is the PvP equivalent of the most skilled raider in a Top 10 PvE guild. At the end of the video some less experienced players had an opportunity to float some questions by him. A couple of these questions dealt with rather unconventional stat builds which Venruki hadn’t considered and stumped him. He didn’t strike me as the least bit embarrassed or defensive about not knowing the correct answer right away. He just said that he wasn’t sure, but that he’d be happy to try and work out an answer for them later. That is the sort of lack of ego that you need to keep getting better even when you’ve reached the top and one of the biggest reasons why he is so good.
2) A willingness to seek out other players as well as online resources to learn what it is you could be doing better and practice those things until you are good at them. In short, you need to have work ethic. Gladiators aren’t born. They start out as shitty players and work hard to get that good. In addition to looking for new, improved tactics you need to be prepared to work hard to ditch whatever bad habits you’ve developed and develop positive ones in their place. This will certainly involve experimenting with many different builds for your character(s), but also rethinking things as fundamental to the way that you play as your UI and keybindings. You need to be the sort of person to say “I may have used these bindings for the past decade, but there’s a decent chance that this other set of bindings will be better once I get used to them so I’m going to work at learning them and adapting to them. Then, if they don’t work I am prepared to go back.” The best recent examples which I can think of in my personal experience are my friends Claydo and Hesterry. They are both incredibly focused and are always looking for ways they can become better, more efficient players. They’re also great about sharing knowledge. It’s important that we’re a group of players who share every new concept that has any merit and scrutinize it together. That’s how we’ll all get better together.
3) Patience. You will fail a lot on the road to becoming good. You will make mistakes and cost your team games. Your teammates will repeat mistakes and frustrate you. You must always be thinking about what you can do in the next game. You should be sharing your thoughts about what you and others could improve while remaining calm and respectful and listening carefully when your teammates bring up suggestions of their own. You will not get anywhere if you are too proud to recognize when you have made mistakes and you will be miserable and make others miserable if you are disrespectful and rude to them. The very best players are always patient, respectful teammates. My friends Disrupta and Idio are both players blessed with tremendous patience. They are both superb players. Two of the very best that I know. They have achieved that level of success with hard work, but even still they are patient with teammates, never rage, and always have good, constructive criticism to offer. They also are quick to consider any critiques which others might share with them.
In my opinion the presence of these three key personal qualities (Lack of Ego, Work Ethic, Patience) are the same things which make someone a good raider or, frankly, good at anything in life. You guys are good people and good raiders so you can be good PvPers too if you are willing to apply those wonderful qualities to this new environment. It will be frustrating at first. It will require developing an intimate understanding of not just your own abilities, but those of all of your teammates and opponents as well. It will take a lot of time to become a great player, but if you want to do it and have the time to invest then you will get there. I know this is true.
So the question I’m going to ask isn’t whether you are a great PvPer now, but rather whether you want to become one?
Wouldn’t it be awesome to be out in the world doing your farming or dailies and instead of getting ganked by that player who jumps you at half health you use your PvP skills to calmly dispatch them and their buddy you piles on a few seconds later? Wouldn’t it be great to achieve success not just in your raid, but also in the arena or Rated BGs as well, becoming a more complete player? If those sorts of things sound appealing to you then let it be known in this thread and Georgepatton, Aeolyn and myself will do our able best to connect you with the people and resources to help you reach your goals. We’re free on Mumble, we’re free on Skype, we’re free in game. Contact us whenever. If you don’t see Kognus online then look at the guild notes because there’s a good chance that I’ll be on one of my alts.
I am going to be editing this post and adding a list of online resources as well as my own thoughts on how everything PvP in WoD is looking. You can expect a bunch of updates over the course of this evening and over the next few weeks.


10 Things that Separate 2500 Teams from Everyone Else
Georgepatton — Tue, 10/28/2014 - 10:17When you play a video game, you play to win. Winning in PVP is 2500+ rating. 2200 is not winning. 2.1k is not winning. Here's 10 things that separate 2500 teams from everyone else. This is for arena and battlegrounds. (List in sequential order of time, not importance)
1) Movement. Everyone is as-fast-as-possible, together, react instantly, in RBGs out the gate in a hurry and get to the node first.
2) Positioning. Pillar hugging, ramp-kiting, dodging around buildings, not running away from healers, in range of both current and focus target, all when applicable.
3. Target selection. Knowing which targets are most vulnerable. Targeting DPS when they have high burst. Having all DPS on a target, not just hitting random, different enemies (with certain exceptions).
4. Focus Target Awareness. Having healer (or peel) focus targets locked and strategically CCing to prevent a friendly kill or assist in an enemy kill. This is essential for #5 and #6, perhaps the most important parts of PVP.
5. Perfect CC trains. Can keep 1 or 2 healers 100% locked down for 15+ seconds...that doesn't mean stunning them 1 second after the cyclone ends and letting them get a heal off. They have a set plan for taking turns on CC. They communicate DR's.
6. Globaling Switch Targets: Communicate a countdown for not just switching to a target, but have spells in cast time to hit at T-0, with melee also hitting the target at the 0 second mark, to achieve a true Global. Activating offensive cooldowns.
7. Knowing when to switch: Switching away when target is protected (Short duration, long cooldown defensive ability). Then switching back if HoTs are off. Not thinking a target is impossible to kill just because a defensive ability was used on them. Understanding which targets are most vulnerable. Having a UI that can tell you what defensive cooldowns and HOTs are on enemy targets (plural emphasized).
8. Healer interrupt avoidance. Utilizing instacasts, moving out of range of interrupts, fearing warlock pets (paladin), reduced casting time abilities, strategically utilizing anti-interrupt abilities, and juking. Using healing cooldowns after interrupts are blown (or before, when necessary).
9. Reactive Peeling - For longer fights, watching your teammates health (even when DPS), interrupting burst dps, forcing top DPS to use defensive cooldowns (slowing down their DPS).
10. Strategic Awareness - Protecting the flag, securing favorable positioning, avoiding traps, proper positioning (and prehealing) of the flag carrier, preparing to recover orbs, and other important considerations.
I agree with all of this. I
Kognus — Tue, 10/28/2014 - 11:21I agree with all of this. I know that with hard work we can achieve this level of coordination in our group. By the way, George. With Arraben's help we've recruited an experienced target caller for the team (a DK named Rekt) and he has transfered to Gorg and joined the guild now.
Great Read!
Arraben — Thu, 10/23/2014 - 22:43I couldn't agree more with Kognus's thoughts on becoming a good PvPer. With everything said Kognus and Aoelyn are very intelligent and open minded people on the topic of PvP! I recommend reaching out to them most definitely if you have questions regarding PvP or anything in that realm haha. I for one am putting my name down for becoming apart of the PvP festivities going on, such as Rated Bgs, arenas, Ashran etc. I hope to see more people on board such as Painhax! See you all on the battlefield! For the Alliance!!!
I want in on this. And I want
Painhax — Thu, 10/23/2014 - 15:26I want in on this. And I want to be good... very good. I will learn whatever I need too. (that said my PVE will come first so if I am screwed in that regaurd I apologize) I will give my time and patience and whatever else I can provide.
I want a very methodical group and a very competitive group. I do not want to be a part of a group that will rage at anyone because of a loss etc.. I just dont have time for that bullshit. Of course I will be upset we lose but with what you said Kog.. patience and understanding.
On top of all of this I don't want someone achieving a goal -title, mount, whatever- and boning out. I want to be with the best, work with the best, and continue to thrive until the group is sure that its all we have left.
I will listen, learn, win, lose, whatever it takes as long as we have a great time and do our best to be the best.
I will be a holy or disc priest for pvp
Awesome, Pain! That's what i
Kognus — Thu, 10/23/2014 - 15:34Awesome, Pain! That's what i like to hear, man. My goal is to do RBGs at least two nights per week to begin with. I am going to choose one night when one of our main raids is running and another night when another is going so that we can get a cross-section of interested raiders involved. We'll also be organizing lots of off night activities (helping pair people for arena teams, talking strategy, doing random BGs to gear up alts) in addition to the RBG team and Aeolyn's Ashran team!
This is going to be so much fun. As much as I love raiding I am excited to be working on this new project with guildies and getting an opportunity to get really focused on one side of the game for once. I'm also trying to get a head start by at least playing every class at level 90 prior to the expansion and trying everything out so that I can be familiar with the basics.
The WoD PVP initiative
Aeolyn — Thu, 10/23/2014 - 14:38Well said!
It will probably be difficult to convince people to get on board this initiative until the next PVP season (or, at the very least, the WoD launch so that Ashran is a thing). But I would definitely like to get as much of a head-count as possible to see what we're working with. RBGs are a hell of a lot of fun and I would personally like to see a bunch of us earning our vicious saddle mounts together going forward.
If you're thinking about taking PVP even semi-seriously in WoD I'd highly suggest that PVP fans build a Gladiator Sanctum in their WoD Garrison, btw. It lets you earn titles, PVP gear, and lets you do a 40 man free-for-all scenario that works more or less like the Darkmoon Faire / Gurubashi Arena challenge. And that also awards a unique title that I'd like to get for us PVP minded folks who care to lend a hand. There's a lot of stuff to be done in WoD with PVP -- and Blizz says that they intend to expand Ashran over the course of the expansion. I'd really like to know who I can count on to be with us.
I agree, Aeolyn, but the
Kognus — Thu, 10/23/2014 - 15:35I agree, Aeolyn, but the faster we get on top of working out some preliminary plans the quicker we'll be able to adapt when we realize that we're mistaken about a few things and need to change course. My main focus in the first two weeks of the expansion is going to be just leveling like mad. I want to have at least three and ideally four level 100 characters prior to the start of the season.