Warlock DPS
Tankard — Wed, 03/04/2009 - 15:43
I'm looking for tips for doing more damage. On Patchwerk last night I managed 4870 dps which is about the best I've done. However, I'm looking at WWS parses for the best Patchwerk kills and their warlocks are getting over 7000 dps (and mages are close behind - our mages need to find out why too). There is not a large gear difference between them and I and the talents are pretty much identical. I am still getting used to playing affliction which could account for some of it, and they are all using a Doomguard (which is 1300 dps as opposed to my imp which is 650). So, considering those things and changing up a potion cycle I might be able to get up to 5800 dps. That still leaves me 1200+ dps short of what they're doing and I'm baffled.
I hit about 6K dps on
Tankard — Thu, 03/19/2009 - 02:20I hit about 6K dps on Patchwerk tonight, though Saedo needs to fix the parses to show it :-) Slowly getting there. I think if I had tricks of the trade and PI I'd be rocking pretty close to that 7K goal. I also picked up some items tonight which have allowed me to change out gear and get my haste up to 680. I've sacrificed a bunch of spell power for that, we'll see how it goes. I logged out in my raiding gear if people want to check it out on the armory.
When I was destro I had been using the Chaotic Skyflare meta which required 2 blue gems. I completely forgot that the requirement was different for the meta I changed to for affliction. I changed out those blue gems a few days ago (thanks Mori).
I think I'll be just about maxing my damage as affliction by the time the next patch comes out and I have to switch back to destruction. That's the way the ball bounces I guess. I'm really hating affliction anyway. My spell "rotation" involves 8 different spells and I have to concentrate so hard on what I'm doing I give myself a headache.
Boo, I request a written
saedo — Thu, 03/19/2009 - 11:17Boo, I request a written request for each of these! ;p
Tricks and PI
moriella — Thu, 03/19/2009 - 04:33You cant lean on tricks and PI to push you to 7k. I just checked the Fusion parses, their healing priest was holy that night (no PI) and none of the parses show any warlocks getting tricks of the trade either.
You are really starting to pump out dps on that fight, unquestionably. But the remaining bit to 7k is gonna be the hard part....
Your dot up time is still a little weak. I'm looking forward to next week to see what you do with the new haste and proper gemming. I think your spellpower is fine at about 2100 unbuffed.
also, remember those Fusion parses are for 2 minute fights, which increases the effective dps during heroism and speed pots greatly - you may not be able to hit 7k until our entire raid dps comes up a bit more. Then again, you might turn into a bad ass super lock and hit it on a 2:40 fight . I think 6500-6700 is a kick ass realistic goal to push for when our average fight time is factored in. Rock on man!
Grats to PD as well, even running scorch spec, your dps shot up tonight..
Looks like I may have to modify the PI macro soon <target>
random
moriella — Thu, 03/12/2009 - 14:41the tooltip says random. If haste is the obvious need, which it is.... then why play with rng? A haste potion 100% of the time till give 500 haste / 15 sec... this rng alch pot will sometimes give 15 sec/haste.....
Frankly, The pot is but one of several issues. Changing the type pot used, will not fix all the issues.
Think of the potion like the sprinkles on a cupcake. We still have to work on the frosting before the sprinkles matter.
I'll donate the gems to gem properly, if gold is of issue
edit: your pet did not show up in parses online, however using saedo's other link you came in at 5800 with pet. Unfortunatly the parses from premonition showing them at almost 7k dps are no longer online, so I cant tell if their parses were with or w/o pet.
Looking at Fusion's latest
saedo — Thu, 03/12/2009 - 15:05Looking at Fusion's latest Patchwerk kill: http://wowwebstats.com/kfsgr42wd1kes?s=303575-323157
Top locks are at 7K dps. Kill was 2:12 vs our 2:45. There is a Doomguard there. They parsed it on March 11th, vs our March 10th, don't think there was a quick hotfix and it should be server side if it were. I wonder why ours won't show certain pets properly while theirs do. I'll have to look into it.
I think it may have to do
Keisjaa — Thu, 03/12/2009 - 16:07I think it may have to do with one of the log submitters being the warlock himself (might explain why some logs do & some don't have pets done correctly)
it may also just be one of those random bug/glitch things
Nope. Apparently the
saedo — Thu, 03/12/2009 - 16:16Nope. Apparently the "hardcore guilds" that wanna see everything properly will go into the logs and insert a line to assign pet to owner.
Done, this is the night with
saedo — Thu, 03/12/2009 - 16:05Done, this is the night with Doomguards properly assigned to Tankard: http://wowwebstats.com/3zgpcntxqryvg?s=427369-458612&m
So apparently I have to open up some 150MB text file and insert a few lines to get it to properly assign it.
I request that there be no more than 1 lock in the raid if I have to continually do this, shouldn't be too hard for us. ;p
had you considered
Kogarasumaru — Mon, 03/16/2009 - 01:17Looking over the parses that saedo linked and also considering a lot of the recent theorycrafting at EJ and on the forums. Have you considered trying to use your succubus for pretty much every fight she can survive. It has been proven that she will do more dps than the other two pets, and that with your spec 1 point into demonic power which you had before will boost her dps about 50 or so. Also my other question to you tankard is why do you not drop immolation from your rotation at sub 25% and start drainsoul rotation instead of shadowbolt rotation? It has been proven many times that with all the current talents that boost drain soul and the fact that it does 4 times the dmg against targets below 25% health that its dpct surpasses that of shadowbolt spam.
Basically you should drainsoul starting right after 25% and watch for when it tick, and only stop draining to refresh dots or debuffs, and make sure that you stop right after a tick to get full benefit from it since it has a base tick time of three seconds.
Got examples of the
saedo — Wed, 03/04/2009 - 16:29Got examples of the parses?
Cause the thing to keep in mind when you're looking at the highest dps ones is Fight Duration. The shorter the fight is, the higher Heroism uptime is, and the higher individual dps is ramped up because of it. The ones to better compare yourself to would be ones where they end the fight at nearly the exact same times, which last night was 2 min 37 sec, for a ~25% Heroism uptime.
Edit: So looking at the first non-anonymous one: http://wowwebstats.com/ook4hw3ghro2o?s=426833-450540
They killed Patchwerk in 1 min 37 sec, that gave em a 41% Heroism uptime. Simplistically speaking, that's about a (41 - 25)% x 30% = 4.8% more spell haste they had cause of a shorter fight.
Yes, I do understand that.
Tankard — Wed, 03/04/2009 - 16:43Yes, I do understand that. But that's slightly offset by the fact that if the Patchwerk fight time lasts over 2 mins, you can use a potion of Speed twice.
One thing to note is that these guys who are killing Patchwerk 1 minute faster than we are are not better geared than we are, so what they are doing differently is a matter of raid makeup and/or execution.
No. Potions are only
saedo — Wed, 03/04/2009 - 16:56No. Potions are only allowed one use per fight. Well, unless you die. So there is no offset. Heroism uptime is a huge factor.
Yep, one potion per fight.
Derchlon — Wed, 03/04/2009 - 17:04Yep, one potion per fight. Unless you cheat and pop one RIGHT before the boss pull. It starts the CD, so you can use a second one 1 min later. You'll probably only get a couple of seconds bonus from the first pot, but every little bit helps.
Most groups posting Patch
Shihli — Wed, 03/04/2009 - 16:46Most groups posting Patch times that fast are running 2 tank, 2 healer setups.
from what i have seen
Kogarasumaru — Wed, 03/04/2009 - 16:06Tankard from what i have noticed the best i have personally done is 6300. But I have talked to a few other locks, read forums, and looked at wws parses. What i have noticed is that to achieve above 7000 most the locks have been given a power infusion and tricks of the trade, and heroism is popped to maximize the amount of drain soul executes that can be done. I hope this helps some but also there is a drain soul rotation on the forums that helps maximize the number of ticks you get plus ensuring that none of your dots or debuffs drop off.
I hadn't thought about power
Tankard — Wed, 03/04/2009 - 16:36I hadn't thought about power infusion. That's a major dps increase. Moriella should have it, I'll ask him if he's using it in raid.
power infusion
moriella — Wed, 03/04/2009 - 18:03Rupta is my PI bieatch. Tho I dont give it too him as much as I should
edit : I just looked that the patchwork parse from this thread and all I can say is OMFG. I saw other guild parses with warlocks and mages absolutly blowing ppl away in damage back when we were working on 5min maly. Can we get some mage/loc cooperation/theorycrafting and figure out how these others are blowing us away. I've heard so much QQ about loc dps, but it seems they are still amazing - when played right.
edit 2 : I decided to look a little deeper. Comparing your character to the 4 locs in that parse. To get where you want to go is going to take some work on your part. WoTLK can be beaten w/o min/maxx but you still cant excel w/o min/maxx strategy. Drop Alchemy, get JC - the bonus is too large for any caster. Stop gemming MP5 and stam. You also need to change your spec, you are spending points to increase the speed of your imp cast (minimal dps to start with) and not maxxing imp shadow bolt, which is LARGE DPS. Start to read EJ warlock forums, ALOT. I checked them out and there is TONS of warlock stuff there. You have a HEALERS trinket equipped, or did you think it would HoT your dps target? <Scratching head> While your spell power and crit are in line with those 4 warlocks, your HASTE is 5-6% lower than each of them. Look into this. Grab a dps spreadsheet from EJ and start to plan your gear, spending raid points on a healing trinket is fail. Those are points you should have saved to insure you won a roll on something actually valuable for your class
I'm not dropping alchemy.
Tankard — Thu, 03/05/2009 - 15:54I'm not dropping alchemy. Too much invested in it, but yes there's a bunch of extra spell dmg in JC. The healer trinket adds 111 spell damage. That's more than any other trinket in game atm and I did the math. That 111 is more on average than those trinkets that occasionally proc 750. Besides, it procs off of drain health and makes me happy in pvp :-) The only stam gems I've got are in pvp gear. The MP5 gemming (and I think there's only one of those and it's SP + MP5) is because I need that gem for my meta to work. My haste is not lower than theirs since I finally got the neckpiece for the Heart. The 1 point in imp is debatable since it increases my imps dps by about 60. It may be better to have that point in imp SB I'll look into it. In other words, I understand everything you've said here, but there are reasons for all of it that has nothing to do with ignorance on my part.
dps suggestions
moriella — Wed, 03/11/2009 - 00:40So a week passed . I also took another look at your gear as it stands.
Lets address one thing at a time
Yes, itś got a bit more SP. However, that doesnt mean itś a good trinket for a Warlock. There are 7 trinkets listed for a lock that are better than this. Two of which are badge gear. The Sundial and the Egg are far superior. Both offer about 20 less SP but also another GOOD proc, like haste, which I think(and comparative parses show ) you are in serious need of. If you like it in pvp, use it in PvP. Itś not a raiding trinket. Check the trinket thread on EJ. This one isnt even listed.
You still have the same purple stam+sp gem in your pants. The pants need a red and yellow gem for the +haste effect. You have an orange. Socket another haste or at the least a +19 sp red gem here. You dont need any purple gems for your meta
Yes, thats what you have currently. However, you dont need that purple gem for your meta to work. You need 3 reds for your meta, which you allready have elsewhere in your gear. Itś not an optimal gem and you have no need for it. Ditch it.
You have approx 400 haste, top locks are running 600+ haste. Thats a substantial difference.
I looked at the new parses for premonition, unfortunatly all I could get was some patchwork parses from test server. They rolled with two affliction locks. Their spell usage is Incinerate 55%, Immolate 10% and conflag 10% - this seems odd, Rotation isnt something I will pretend to know about. However, their spec is still a little different from what you are running. Two or three points in a spec, may not seem like much - but when trying to min/max , it can make the difference.
To get out some more dps, you could have also popped a speed pot just before the fight and then another speed pot partway thru the fight. It shows you used a crazy alch potion at some point instead. I not sure why you would need a health and mana potion during this fight. Seems like your pot cd could have been better used.
"Their spell usage is
Desteran — Thu, 03/12/2009 - 16:02"Their spell usage is Incinerate 55%, Immolate 10% and conflag 10% - this seems odd,"
If this was their rotation they were destuction, not affliction.
spec
moriella — Thu, 03/12/2009 - 16:35It's very possible for that parse that I was able to find, they specced destro to test. WHen I armoried them again , they were def aff. I agree, it seemed odd to me.
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Looking at fusions latest parses, I think I've identified another pretty big difference. All three of their locks have Drain Soul in their rotation while you havnt used it. This could be making a difference. Your DoT up time looks pretty good. For example, you had 49 tics of Corruption out of a possible 55 tics.
Get more haste, gem properly, flask, get Drain Soul into your rotation and I bet you can get it even higher this week.
You really need to get in on our Maly kills tho. There are some BiS Haste pants there that would help you alot.
One thing you should know
Disrupter — Wed, 03/11/2009 - 06:58One thing you should know about professions. The static buff of Enchanting (38 sp) and Alchemy (37 sp xtra from flask) is pretty hot. Couple with the xtra 2 hours on a flask and such make it a very nice raiding profession. Not the 100% optimal, but I certainly would hate to lose it. (The only reason I haven't dropped a profession for engineering, is because of how useful each one is in raiding.)
That being said, Crazy Alchemist Potions are, basically, a haste potion Moriella. If you pop it at full health it's supposed to give 500 haste on top of the health/mana effect. It's pretty pimp to have your dps potion also heal you and regen your mana :D.
And for Crazy Alchemist
saedo — Wed, 03/11/2009 - 12:03And for Crazy Alchemist Potion, is it really just haste? Seems random.
Looking over last night looks like:
It's supposedly less random
Disrupter — Wed, 03/11/2009 - 12:19It's supposedly less random and more based on what your current stats are. I couldn't say for sure as I haven't tested it, but it was stated by commenters on wow head that a pattern was noticed. Generally when full health you'd get the haste proc, etc.
Though I'm sure you'd find out more about it then me Saedo, I still generally just opted for the haste potions to be sure.
Another thing about JC is
saedo — Wed, 03/11/2009 - 11:50Another thing about JC is that it may be optimal now. But the day they introduce epic gems, it'll fall back in line with the other professions. And Blacksmithing will be supreme! Well unless they introduce new ranks of things.
Meh, he might have picked up
starstalker — Wed, 03/04/2009 - 18:28Meh, he might have picked up the foresight talisman for NRP. It went to NRP on tuesday. The only dps trinket for badges is [Sundial of the Exiled], but I don't know how many badges he has.
I don't have any helpful
starstalker — Wed, 03/04/2009 - 16:01I don't have any helpful info, other than 2 pages over at EJ that seemed to look ok
http://elitistjerks.com/f80/t37918-affliction_raiding_rotations_guide/
http://elitistjerks.com/f80/
That affliction guide is
garreth — Wed, 03/04/2009 - 18:54That affliction guide is amazing, I wish I had one that good for all our classes.
afflock guide
Scaron — Fri, 03/06/2009 - 14:46FYI...this is the expanded version of the afflock guide at EJ:
http://elitistjerks.com/f80/t37900-dots_you_affliction_warlock_thread/